RFC: Cats, Rake and Prowl
RFC stands for “Request For Comments” — which basically means that I need your help (again!). I’m getting a lot of questions about the pros and cons of each pet family and in particular the pet family skills. But there’s no way that I really test all the pet families in every situation myself, so I want to hear about your experiences with them! (And yes, with 32 pet families this could take awhile.)
Today’s RFC: The Cat family and their two family skills: Rake and Prowl.
Cats have always been popular, not just for their power and flexibility, but also for their astounding good looks. But for a lot of hunters, the good looks were just the frosted sugar on top of a very powerful donut, so to speak.
With Patch 3.0, though, lots of pets are powerful and useful — some arguably more powerful than cats, if you can imagine such a thing. Now I know that cats are still a good pet — my main leveled from 70 to 80 with her cat Cloud — but I am very interested in hearing your opinions on how they stack up to other pets these days.
So if you’ve had any experience hunting with Cats in a post-Patch 3.0 world, take a moment to comment and let me know what you think. In particular, I’d like to know:
- What are the pros and cons of Cats in general?
- What are the pros and cons of Rake in particular? How about Prowl? Do you find yourself making use of both these skills?
- Are Cats particularly good (or bad) for soloing, grouping, raiding, PvP, tanking, damage-dealing, etc?
- What talents do you suggest for Cats? Are there any required talents, or talents you should definitely skip?
- Do you know any clever strategies for hunting with Cats, or are there any particular gotchas to watch out for?
- Would you recommend a Cat?
(These are just guideline questions — you need’t try to address each one in turn. And yes, this post looks a lot like the other RFCs — after all I’m asking the same questions!)
I’m especially looking for input from people who have been hunting with Cats for the past month or so (since Patch 3.0), but even if you haven’t, feel free to throw if your theorycrafting — just let us know whether your advice is based on experience or spreadsheets (or both)!
This post will remain here as a reference for the future, and additionally I’ll try to distill the basics down into a brief summary for use on Petopia.
As always, thanks for your help!
49 Comments
This is purely anecdotal, and perhaps somewhat biased as my first (main, and still the same one) pet is a cat, but I’ve found them to be eminently viable in PvE, and I generally run solo. There are some obvious talents to take, but Bloodthirsty, Charge, Spider’s Bite, and Rabid are a great way to go. My Shiarza puts out the damage like nobody’s business, and I generally have to deliberately work to take aggro off her if I want to (which is terribly rare). Thus, she also works well as a pseudo-tank in small groups with squishies. It’s possible to bite off a little more than she can chew, tankwise, so I generally try not to hurl her into situations where more than 4-5 normal mobs will get on her at once, as Mend Pet aggro can be a bad thing (some mobs…geists in Zul’Drak, and Onslaught types in Icecrown…seem to love to pile on in large bunches, so tread carefully).
What’s not to like about Rake? Prowl, on the other hand, I don’t usually use much unless I’m in a situation where I have no competition for a mob and all the time in the world for my girl to get there.
Yes, I’d recommend cats, especially now. They were easy to maintain before, but you have to work at it to lose Happy status now, and they do the damage and are simple to work with powers-wise. A great first pet, and one that will carry you as far as you want to go with it.
I have a bear, cat, and boar. The boar is left over from leveling to 70. Bear is a great tank. Cat deals DPS very well but the %$%^ Prowl bug (Prowl activates just when you don’t need it) is a pain. I’ve soloed several of the old instances using the Cat and he puts out good DPS. We did die a couple of times doing the giant killing quest in Northrend when Cat died. Tried it with the Bear and managed to take down 4 giants. I do not use Prowl – which is strange since one of my alts is a feral druid and I use prowl there all the time.
I currently only use two ferocity pets: A Spirit Beast and a Cat. I normally take Shia (or Khanu, my other Spirit Beast) with me everywhere because of the bond between us, but for raids, I feel like I cannot bring anyone but my cat Aslan. He easily outdpses my other pets, even when there’s no druid or arms warrior to apply Trauma/Mangle.
Overall, I think cats are currently TOO powerful. Prowl is limited in its use and acceptable for a second skill that many families don’t get, but Rake simply deals too much damage in relation to other pet abilities. I’m somewhat relieved they’re nerfing the damage of Cats, because it means I’ll be able to bring Shia or Khanu to raids with a clean conscience, knowing I’m not unnecessarily reducing my own DPS.
Cats are a solid non-BM pet, but shouldn’t be the best pet for exotic spec’d hunters.
A while back you posted an RFC for owls, and though I stand by my previously professed love for my white owl, at level 76 my hunter made the tough decision to begin looking for a pet to replace her with. Not one to hop on a bandwagon, I didn’t make a point of taming a cat while my hunter was young (pre-BC). I had a ghost sabre that didn’t make it to level 40. Thalestris is now leveling in Sholazar basin (c’meeeeere Loque….come out where ever you are…) so I decided to take a look at what was available to me there. On a whim I tamed Piddles (I didn’t think I’d keep her…really…), one of the dreadsaber cats in the Basin.
Love! I’m very impressed with the cat’s DPS overall. I have used a gorilla almost exclusively for solo play. Now, I can justify bringing Piddles out of the stable for questing because she simple RAPES everything in sight. My playstyle includes a lot of guild runs in 5-man dungeons, and Piddles shines there as well. My gnome mage friend jokes about the view he always gets: massive enraged cat butt!
I don’t use prowl often. It seems to be more PvP oriented and though I enjoy PvP, I make it an end-game time waster between raids. That is to say, while leveling, I don’t mess with it. But when Thal hits 80 and gets some good gear on, Piddles and I will be hitting the PvP scene with stealthy style. Shadowmeld and prowl? Heavenly.
The supposed nerf to cats makes me sad. I’m enjoying my friend’s flying claws of fury. But when Blizz has everything all adjusted and tuned in just right, I’m sure cats will still be an amazing pet. I’m looking forward to dragging Piddles (who will be renamed, I’m sure) to Naxx and beyond. Overall, she’s a very solid, gorgeous, and powerful companion.
I have been raiding with a cat, and I am unhappy about the proposed nerf. I love cats – as you said, the skins are gorgeous, and also they are much less irritating to the rest of the group than other larger/louder pets. ;) The problem with many other raiding pets is that often the family skills don’t stack with other debuffs. It’s why I stopped raiding with my wasp, and why I had high hopes for worms until I realised that it’s pointless to use them with a warrior tank. My cat usually does about 200 less dps than a guildmate’s devilsaur, which is fine. Since (pre-nerf) I’m still BM/MM, my pet is important for my damage – I honestly don’t know what pet I might switch to for raiding, as there aren’t any other really shiny choices. For solo grinding a cat can’t compare to a gorilla, which I think is hands-down the best solo/grinding/tanking pet. If cats become non-viable for raids, why would we use them?
I hunt with my cat, Troika, and still very much still recommend cats in general. :-) I have a warp stalker for questing, farming, and dailies, but I still prefer my cat I tamed way back at level 10.
Right now, she’s my raiding and instance pet. She’s already seen the new Naxx once and will be going back with me on Sunday. I chose talents that would increase her damage and/or get her back into the fight as soon as possible. My only complaint about Lick Your Wounds is that my pet seems to sometimes draw healing aggro by using it at the wrong time.
Pros:
- Great Damage
- Great looks
- Lack of annoying sound effects (my main reason for avoiding exotics)
Cons:
- Not as durable as other pets
- Easier to pull aggro from (circumvented by MD pulling)
Thoughts on Rake/Prowl: I leave Rake on all the time, unless I’m in the rare situation where the raid or group leader says “No DOTs, please.” Every little bit of damage helps! On the other hand, I’ve never had a consistent use for Prowl. I’ve used it a few times to avoid mobs when I’ve had to suddenly go AFK and where I’ve needed to hide while waiting for a PVP flag to wear off. Otherwise, I turn it off and leave it off.
Cats are absolutely dominant for dps in any kind of grouping environment, barring a scorpid or a devilsaur, and those are only in certain situations. This has been proven mathematically and in a post-patch 3.0.8 world, cats will probably still reign supreme over all other non-exotic pets for DPS.
Rake is amazing — it scales so well with the pet’s attack power I expect it to be nerfed any day now. Just watching the DOT tick, it’s like having Claw go off twice as often.
Prowl, however, is worthless as always. There has been and always will be a single use for prowl, and even then, only as a night elf, and that’s defending the flag in Warsong Gulch in conjunction with shadowmeld.
Cats are okay for soloing, I suppose — whether you prefer tenacity or ferocity pets for solo situations is a personal thing, and I’m a tenacity kind of guy myself.
Most of what follows is the same as my last ferocity pet overview, with a few tweaks here and there for cats. Without further adieu…..
In general, cats are very, VERY good pets. Once the ‘king’ of pets, cats are still in the running for best DPS, and in general make good overall pets. Prowl is very situational, with those situations mostly popping up in PvP.
Cats are good all rounders, where the only situations you want to shy away from them are off tanking situations. Being ferocity, they have the ability to come back from the dead twice. Once literally, and again with lick your wounds. PvP they tend to excel in, thanks to prowl giving them a rather nasty ‘SURPISE!! Your being gnaewd on!’ edge.
Rake is a VERY nice damage suppliment, offering an initial ‘claw’ damage, and then following it with a bleed DoT. Currently, only two things that I remember can get rid of bleeds, Luffas up to level sixty, and the new fifty one point rogue talent. Aside from that, phyiscal immunity effects such as divine shield and hand of protection will also dispel it. In other words, not an easy Dot to get rid of, and currently ticks for fairly good damage. Prowl, on the other hand, is a mixed bag. Mainly geared for PvP, its only good in PvE if you want a little extra bite in your pets opening attack. Cons to cats are the general ferocity pet cons, mainly an overall less amount of survivabilty and no real special techniques to add the hunter. Call of the wild is on a prohibitive cooldown without a truly major buff number to back it up. Rake’s ticks can break crowd control.
Cobra reflexes is more or less required for all ferocity pets. The increased attack speed goes a long way in dishing out more pain, which is what ferocity is all about. Bloodthirsty is nearly THE required talent for ferocity, providing healing AND a constant stream of happiness for your pet, while spiked collar ups damage output. Charge is very nice for solo and PvP play, and for getting your pet back into position in a hurry, while avoidance is a required for another high end talent that you DEFINITELY want, Rabid. Avoidance is great on its own for decreasing AoE damage, which is very important for instance play. Heart of the phoenix works as a spring loaded panic button, allowing you to instantly revive your pet once every ten minutes, no downsides there. Spiders bite is another nearly required talent, but with a caveat: Primarily for beastmasters. Criticals are super important for beastmasters, and spiders bite ups the ante by an entire 9%, an insane amount. Rabid. Take it. The increase to damage is amazing, and if you’ve taken Cobra reflexes, frenzy, and serpents swiftness then you’ll have close to an entire fifteen seconds of boosted DPS from it. Finally, call of the wild. Personally, I don’t think its worth a talent point, but the 10% increase can be useful in the right situations. Weigh whether or not its worth it to you personally, then take it or leave it. ((Ahhh, bless copy paste.))
Prowl, then beastial wrath, kill command, call of the wild if you got it, and trinket right before your cat reaches the enemy. Watch as your pet opens up with one NASTY rake or claw, preferably rake.
At the end of the day, it’s all a matter of style. I personally am a cat lover, as attested to by my own friendship ((Some’d say ownership, but tell that to mycats)) of twenty odd cats. If you like cats, an effective and nice damaging family skill, and the overall sleek, sexy feel of a feline, then yea, I totally recommend them. Plus, they are fun, and purty.
I pretty much agree with everyone here. I had a cat before pach 3.0 that I tamed at level 32(a level 19 Ghost Saver which I then leveled back when it was a bit more difficult) and she’s been with me ever since. Back when I first tamed her, she still dished out nice damage because of both bite(when it wasn’t a focus dump) and claw, but now with rake and claw, it’s so much better. I’m a survival hunter and have never used my pet for tanking, but without growl on(mind you WITHOUT) she’s actually a good tank. With growl she’s just that much better. In that way rake is way too overpowered, but as I’m not BM, she’s my best pet choice(and the fact that I simply love cats helps too ^^). Many people would say gorillas are, but they are way too big and clumsy for me.
So pros for me is definately looks, damage(as it is now), elegance(VERY important for me), the company and cuteness. I can’t think of anything bad about cats. I even use prowl all the time. As I don’t use my pet for a tank, I often click prowl and then just start shooting the mob while my cat is sneaking up from behind. It might not be ideal for everyone, but it works perfectly for me.
Talentwise…I don’t take Heart of the Phoenix, because, again, my pet doesn’t tank very often thus doesn’t die very often. Must have talents, for me atleast, is Cobra Reflexes, Avoidance, Rabid, Bloodthirsty, Spider’s Bite, Spiked Collar and Call of the Wild. Back in the days, Dash was almost required for any pet, but now I see no use for it.
Cats are in my eyes good for everything, even tanking, and thus it saddens me to see Blizz nerf Cats. They might need it, but I really don’t want to feel like I have to stable my dear Mina=( To me, Cats have been hit by too mnay nerfs these days, so I wouldn’t recommend a Cat yet, until I know how bad the damage reduction is. Although, if you’re very look-focused, as I am in game, then I’d definately recommend a cat. So many skins, so many models, so cute.
*Ghost Saber
Good I can spell my own pet’s original name =P
Im overjoyed with the incommin rake nerf actually.
Right now, cats are simply too good , while alot of the other pets skills cancels out in a raid settin, or simply dont have any real use in a raid setting (Tendon Rip for example).
At least I finaly found a cat skin that I find somewhat cool, if they could only remove those silly HUGE fangs….
Cats are this Hunter’s absolute favourite partner. No matter what your level, you can find a kitty at or very close to your level and there is no other pet family that has more choices; not only in skin colour, but even in type (lion, lynx, panther, tiger). A good Hunter can use a cat to do pretty much anything: solo, groups, raids (actually my guild prefers that I bring the cat). It is mainly a dps pet, but with a healer watching it can do some off-tanking. No idea about PvP, since I don’t do PvP.
Its best pro, also is its worst con: everyone has a cat sometime during their Hunter career. So unless you have a rare version, no one will look twice at your partner and you’ll be seen as just another DPS Hunter. Even some of the old rares are no longer seen as rare because the quest has become available to all (Shy-Rotam). The older hunters and cat lovers know and often still dread the times when you couldn’t walk in IF without tripping over a Broken Tooth clone just because it had the fastest attack speed.
About Prowl I can be very clear, they didn’t give cats another skill for nothing. Prowl is always off and the current Prowl/Cower bug is driving me nuts! Not only does it slow the cat to a crawl when just walking around, in fights it has become useless if you also have dash on. When dash or any other speed enhancing talent activates, prowl goes bye bye and so does any extra damage it may have done. Currently in my mind Prowl is only useful when you are a Night Elf and you have to go afk for a few minutes. In other words: Prowl = safer Bathroom break.
Rake on the other hand may not look like much number wise, but it’s one of those “turn it on and forget about it” skills. I’ve had a time when my cat was focus starved and I turned off claw before even thinking about turning off rake. I don’t go by numbers, only how fast mobs go down and during my testing rake was more effective. Of course Rake + Claw = very dead mob very fast.
Cats have one oddity, that I still can’t explain. They hold aggro like it’s their favourite toy. Yes, if I go nuts with my shots (BM) then I’ll outaggro my cat. Some mobs love/hate Arcane Shot so much just one shot will draw them to me, SSO Isle crackelves and constructs are prime examples of that. However, my cat holds better aggro than any same-level other pet out there, especially the tanks (Warpstalker and Gorilla in my case). Please remember to use Cower in groups if your pet is part of the DPS team, cats can build aggro pretty fast even without growl. My brother’s gorilla didn’t stand a chance trying to retake aggro when she took over from him for a few seconds (he needed a bit of time to heal). That said, a word of warning: trying to use a cat as main tank is a nono. You may get away with it solo or grouped outside (especially with a healer watching the cat’s back), but in instances and especially heroics the bosses hit like a truck! Cats do not have the armour nor HP to survive more than two hits and those tend to come fast.
Cats as DPS pets can’t go wrong with Cobra Reflexes, Spiked Collar or any other DPS enhancing skills. Dash is a no-brainer too, not only to close in fast with a mob but also for runners. Heart of the Phoenix is a dream, but remeber to hit that before you use Revive Pet. Talents like Lion-hearted and Lick your wounds depend on your playstyle. For me the first one helps in solo play, but the latter is only useful in team and the mob is smacking something else around. I only use ONE speed skill (Dash), the others are not worth the points that I’d rather put in stuff like Rabid.
Cats can take on multiple mobs: juggling Misdirection, Multi-shot and Volley and then focus fire them down one by one is a skill well worth training, but don’t go overboard. 2 or 3 mobs are fine, 4 is iffy, 5 and more is Feign Death City! Leave the big groups to the gorilladins.
Nearly every hunter I know has seen that dps pets tend to do “the dance” a bit more than other types of pets. You send your pet to a mob or mob aggros pet/you, and they both move away while fighting and try to dance clear to the other side of the zone at times. Cats often have speed skills, so they go out of range and into a group of mobs that much faster. Just call the pet back to your side when you see it happening, let the mob come to you, have em fight it out at your side and then move away to shooting distance.
Would I recommend Cats? Oooh yeah! I don’t call my Draenei Horn style “kitty ears” for nothing. If you like fishing then cats are sure to become your best friend very soon. Unlike so many other pets they know to be silent when stalking prey and roar into action to take it off guard. My guild is always happy to see Asha on a team, instance or raid run and I have yet to see a pet that will take her position as my number one partner. Even the Spirit Beast will not take that place of honour if I ever manage to befriend it.
err, forgot to add , even after the nerf, cats will still do more damage than the majority of non exotic pets, dont know about raptors and moths, but they will most likely still out dps every other non exotic feriocity pet.
The Prowl bug is annoying, for sure.
I love the current Rake.
Cats look good, no stomping, no annoying animations.
To cover the Cower and Prowl bugs, I have a macro. Actually 2, one for solo, one for groups.
/petautocastoff Cower
/petautocastoff Prowl
/petautocaston Growl
OR
/petautocaston Cower
/petautocastoff Prowl
/petautocastoff Growl
I need to run this macro each time I dismount, or login.
:)
Or just keep them on the pet action bar, then they never reset :p at least not to my experience.
Look all you people are giving cats too much credit. Tekia was totally wrong when he said moths and raptors had a chance against cats, which they do not. However, this is one pet that comes very close, and eventually out dps a cat, and that is a wasp. At lev 80 a wasp sting does 64 to 86 damage(scaled), 1260 armor,While a cat’s rake does 24 to 34, 22 to 28(also scaled). It may seem that rake may outdps sting, AT FIRST, however, as a BM hunter, rake is on a 7 second CD, while Sting is on a 4.2 second CD. I ran several tests,using only rake and sting on a training dummy, and found rake dps about 340 higher than a wasp’s sting after one minute. I then tried 5 minutes and found rake was only 22 higher than sting. Their different CDs, plays a huge role in their DPS. After 6 minutes, Sting was indeed the victor. This means for big bosses, such as Naxx bosses, A wasp will outdamage a cat. A cat’s rake can also FIRST crit, but its bleed effect cannot crit. While a wasp’s sting can always crit.
however, for MM or surv hunters, cats may be better due to them not having the longevity talent, and sting is on 6 sec CD, and rake is on a 10 sec CD
After the nerf to cat’s rake, I expect wasps to be much more common, hunter’s on my servers are starting to wake up from this cat craze, and now slowly, one by one, they are bringing their wasps to Naxx, vault, etc. I recommend a cat for 5 man duegons, as most boss fights there last about 2-3 minutes. While raid fights, that include bosses that take 10+ minutes, a wasp will be better for DPS
I meant, after nerf.
I like rake, especially with the short cooldown. The fact that it can crit when it lands is just a big plus to Beastmaster hunters. I really wish they made the raptor’s family ability as useful. Raptors don’t come close to cats because of the huge cooldown on their dps ability.
I’d agree with the majority of people in saying all the +dps pet talents work great with cats. Call of the wild is iffy, especially since they may make it buff only the hunter instead of a party/raid-wide buff. Rabid is much better. I haven’t tried Lick Wounds yet since I mostly solo with the hunter, and mend pet is enough for my pet’s healing needs.
I didn’t have the whole “cats make uber death threat” thing that other people have, though. Unless I let the cat attack by itself for 2 growls of time, she barely makes enough agro to keep something on her.
Like someone mentioned above, dash and charge seem to cancel prowl, making it a less than useful skill for the average pve gameplay experience.
Rake must be good, is this not two nerfs since it’s introduction?
Unlike some of the posters here, I am not a raider, I have not done a single raid since pre-bc MC and do not plan on doing a single raid in Northrend either.
I play a BM Hunter because I simply love having a companion at all times to bond with while adventuring the great lands of Azeroth, so my focus is not on “min/max” or “best in class” but what suits me, as I do my exploration.
As I stated I am a 51 point BM hunter spec but I do not use any exotics right now as I have not found one that I believe will fit me. I tried Devilsaur, gorilla, worm, core-hound, and even a butterfly.. none of them fit, none of them I could see myself exploring the lands on my great adventure as a companion… so I went back to my cat.
I use the extra 4 talent points you get from 51 point BM spec to help my cat survive better and be a better defender of her companion, me :)
Just a different thought on how to pic pets, the perfect one in my mind is the one that just “fits you”.
As a cat lover, I’d be happy to participate in this RFC XD Please don’t mind if I’m not 100% serious, I can’t do that XD
* What are the pros and cons of Cats in general?
Pros:
Great damage and pretty much the “accepted norm” of Hunter pets. Alot of people use a cat to compare other pets damage. “Increase Spirit Beast DPS to at least equal to a cat’s.” for example.
Common throughout all of leveling. Never tried a cat before? 95% of the time, there is a cat near your level range just waiting to be tried out.
Rake: It’s a great ability. Seriously, it crits alot and that adds up. Kill Command and Cobra Strikes with Rake = Love.
Food: Cats are easy to feed. You never really have to buy food for them. Keep what meat you find as loot. Cat’ll eat it.
Cons:
Prowl: I never use Prowl. It’s pesky and annoying. As a “fast and furious” BM Hunter, I like Dash and Charge primarily, and pre-3.0 that was all I used. Never Prowl. Though, it is fun for moments like in Arena for a Night Elf. Pop up Shadowmeld, Prowl, and you have your own “Aspect of the Rogue”! (Seriously, it’s all for fun XD) However, with Auto-cast bugged, you’ll be turning prowl off and on, so definitely a con.
Not so Unique: If you’re a “unique” pet hunter, chances are, cats are NOT for you. 1 out of 4 Hunters will have a cat.
Rake: Great ability, but sometimes gets in the way of Ice Trap D=
* What are the pros and cons of Rake in particular? How about Prowl? Do you find yourself making use of both these skills?
Rake:
See above mentionings.
Prowl:
See above. It is also just not worthwhile to me. In the time it takes for your pet to “Prowl” to its prey, you could be halfways done killing it.
I only use Rake.
* Are Cats particularly good (or bad) for soloing, grouping, raiding, PvP, tanking, damage-dealing, etc?
I have never had a problem with a cat for soloing. Sure, Rou can’t take an elite same-level as well as my gorilla, but he burns through other mobs so fast, it’s wonderful. Cats also can hold onto aggro really well with their insane dps. Raiding or Groups (if you got a good tank) cat is hands-down great, especially if you’re not a BM exotic hunter. Cats’ rake does more overall than a raptor, and they don’t waste dps. By that I mean, if you take a wolf to a raid, chances are there is a Warrior with the Shout buff. There’s really no need for Furious Howl, other than for yourself. Cats don’t buff other than Ferocious Inspiration (BM) and do damage. DPS is what Hunters do. Bring the hurt.
PVP: Same rules apply. Can’t go wrong with a cat. Fast attacks, great damage. Charge & Dash = love more.
* What talents do you suggest for Cats? Are there any required talents, or talents you should definitely skip?
I reccommend the following. Keep in mind, I’m BM Exotic so I have more points to toss around. XD
Cobra Reflexes: Definitely worth its weight in gold. Faster hits, more Ferocious Inspiration, more damage.
Dash: I’m impatient, so I like Dash. Some say it’s not as important if you get charge, but if you like the occasional PvP, this is a must.
Bloodthirsty: Worth it. Heals your pet for 5% and bonus “feeds” your pet.
Spiked Collar: Extra damage. There’s no reason not to take this skill, fosho =D
Boar’s Speed: Again, I’m impulsive. I like fast pets. However, this may not be worth it if you have Kindred Spirits, but I keep it anyways since I’m not impressed with much else on this tier.
Avoidance: I take it mainly for the upper tier ability, but having your cat dodge is good too. Remember, he’s ferocity, doesn’t take damage like a gorilla.
Charge: Worth it on it’s tier.
Spider’s Bite: Definitely worth it. more damage.
Rabid: Worth it again, pops off alot, and its more damage =D With a cat, you’ll see this buff every other mob (since you burn through mobs quick).
Heart of the Phoenix: Saves you 2 talent points from “Improved Revive Pet”. Most Hunters don’t let their pet die in combat all that often anyways.
Call of the Wild: Has a longer cooldown, but it’s worth it for the extra buff.
Do you know any clever strategies for hunting with Cats, or are there any particular gotchas to watch out for?
Not really. Cats are a standard Hunter pet. Standard rules apply. If your cat is taking more damage than it can dish out and stand, you may be in trouble. Don’t forget, your cat is NOT a gorilladin. He can hold aggro, and he can tank, but he is not going to be tanking for your group against Malygos. (I don’t think a gorilla can either, but I digress)
* Would you recommend a Cat?
Yes! Definitely! If you want a damage dealing pet, and raptors and Wolves aren’t cutting it for you, then go cat. If you’re not an exotic hunter and want a high dps pet, cat. If you’re a hardcore DPS only exotic BM hunter, can’t go wrong with a cat (but you may want to look at a devilsaur if you’re that serious XD)
Lions still look good. Lions still do alot of DpS. Just not as good as the Exotics, like Devilsaurs. I like that Rake does a Damage over Time thing. I don’t like Prowl though. ‘Cause it slows my pet down way too much. They’re good for soloing. Rabid’s good for lions. It increases their DpS. Pet Points are too few and precious to waste on non-DpS Skills. Strategies; Prowl is okay against Horde. It can be used to scare ‘em. lol And yes, I would recommand a lion to non-Beast Mastery Hunters.
Real good, Rikaku!
Cats are fast DPS machines. Down the baddie quickly, and the cat does not take too much damage. If the baddies are too much for the cat, I switch to the gorilla.
It is said that devilsaurs and wasps out DPS a cat. Of the 3, I would rather have a cat beside me, as having a cat pleases me.
cats will still be top dps after the patch as well dps spreadsheets from elitestjerks show the cat being tops still with the recently fixed spirit beast and devilsaur about the same even with the coming rake nerf it still scales well enough with attack power for raiding and pure dps cat is still tops
Honestly it can’t hold my aggro so i don’t use it in solo play. but i’ve found that nothing but a rhino can (i don’t know why the rhino only one that can but it is) so i won’t metion that aspect of play. For group play they are brilliant high damage and if some ones afk and need a gard they are the best pet you can get to do it because if you stay near the cat he’ll look after that member and only agrro what will aggro them member.
for pvp in defence hes just the same
for pvp offence he’s brilliant nuff said
and they look fabulous
All arguments about raw DPS aside, Cats really shine through in PvP.
Prowl: Pretty useless solo, unless you are a Night Elf takig a break while farming/questing. Not very usefull in instances, though it does make some old schoolers who still freak out about pets agroing mobs relax a bit. In Arena you generaly want your pet to ract fast so it wasn’t all that great till the introduction of Death Knights, who can pull your pet across the Arena and kill it.
In Battlegrounds it rocks. In AV you prowl your cat on agressive at the entrance to a bunker, or in WSG/AB next to flags. When an Ally comes in to cap, the cat pounces and you hit intimidate.
Rake: Though seemingly a DoT type DPS, is the only atack any pet has that will 100% prevent a Rogue from going stealth. Cloak of shadows will remove Hunter’s Mark and the Wasp’s stings and, if the Rogue can pop their cooldowns, do it again. Rake, however, is bleed damage. Cloak of Shadows cannot remove a bleed. No stealth, No vanish, dead rogue.
Though Corehounds seem interesting for their casting slow ability, cats should sill be the best for PvP, at least till Exotics get buffed. But, all that aside, cats are awesome for anything you really want to do with them, except main tank.
My BM Ferocity Builds:
Raid DPS (For DPS and surviving those nasty boss’s that AOE)
0030
0230
3-00
-132
111-
Solo DPS (Face it… you’re solo, you’re a hunter, do whatever you want. If you can’t kill it, blame the hunter not the pet.)
0132
0230
3-00
-032
100-
Oops. hit submit too soon.
PvP DPS (Hit fast, hit hard and run ‘em down)
2100
0231
3-01
-131
110-
My Cat: Yoruichi, ZG panther.
Well, to be honest…I’ve had my cat in the stable most of the time since WotLK. However, pre-WotLK, I was all cat. I started out that way with a moonkitty from outside of Auberdine, and I didn’t change until I picked up a Frostsaber in Winterspring.
I can’t add much to whats already been said, except that Prowl can also work with non-Nelfs in PvP. Granted, you have to be smarter about it. But, you can still stash your cat near the flag/entrance/whatever, and plant yourself out of sight. Hit AoB, and you’re invisible to trackers.
In PvE, I only used Prowl in Instancing/Raiding, and then part of a macro. Every little bit counts when you’re taking down a boss. The Prowl/Cower bug is most annoying.
As an overall pet, Cats are hard to beat. Even though at this time, I’m one of the ones lucky enough to have a Spirit Beast; I’m sure that I’ll go back to my cat later on.
Zwingli
I just tamed a cat the other day myself, and have mainly been soloing with him. i couldn’t help but notice the mediocre aggro generation, and that i had to MD pull to keep the mob off me. Maybe in raids these guys are great, maybe you guys think they look good, but i just don’t see it working for me. I admit, the DPS is rather good, but i’m just not seeing it happening, While raiding and soloing, i personally just do better with runetooth (My wolf).
Cats are just a little too flimsy for my taste, and I find that I pull aggro from them too easily.
That said, I do still have my old white lion in the stable, because it was quite a feat to get him as Alliance, but mostly for sentimental reasons.
Honestly, I never liked cats. I know, they have some really elegant and handsome coats out there, but a furball has never been what I like running beside me. For me, it’s always been scales or gtfo. Windserpents, Raptors, and now Devilsaurs. I loved it because, unlike every other hunter who toted around a cat, I felt at least semi-unique in the raiding world. However, as things stand, if I don’t bring a cat, I’m gimping my own dps, it seems. Rake does immense amounts of damage, and with Readiness still in use, albeit heading for the chopping block, the Beast Mastery talent is worthless. I’ve always played the way I wanted, and before LK, that way also gave me outstanding dps; now, unless I respec for raids and tote Neko along with me, my raid group questions my judgment time and again.
Before I treat any further off the beaten path, I’ll sum things up. Cats are amazing for those who want them. Even when their rake damage gets nerfed, it probably won’t be nearly enough to make people not use them. The fact that rake benefits from Trauma/Mangle means it’ll always be handy, and the short cooldown makes it yet another infinite DoT on the boss. However, for people like me, who have always preferred other pets, it’s a little depressing knowing we have to gimp ourselves just to get the pet we want.
all the times i have had a cat it had been humar. but now i hate cats. because of prowl.it comes on every time i summon it continusaly goes into stelth.
Have prowl on the cast bar and it will never reset, simple.
What are the pros and cons of Cats in general?
Only beast with prowl, though they move slower in it the bonus in damage is very nice. That also works kicken for PVP with night elvs, cat on prowl, hunter in shadow meld, horde have no idea you are there, send in cat, they only see cat, focus on it, then you start nailing em. Very very fun :P Con, welp, they can start to go down rather fast, they don’t have the best in armor, and though prowl is nice, it don’t don’t work good on mobs/players that are moving away :P
What are the pros and cons of Rake in particular? How about Prowl? Do you find yourself making use of both these skills?
For prowl, see above, rake? I think it’s a nice damage dealer for a bleed effect. I find a lot of mobs that will flee will go down quicker with rake on them.
Are Cats particularly good (or bad) for soloing, grouping, raiding, PvP, tanking, damage-dealing, etc?
There good all around, though one needs to be careful when soloing to not pull agro, I find them my top choice when in pvp (for reasons above) and for raids/instances due to prowl, less likly to have the pet agro something unwanted. My boy would be the only pet I’d take into kara after a.. pet agro issue on the way to prince >.> stupid waters…
What talents do you suggest for Cats? Are there any required talents, or talents you should definitely skip?
http://www.wowhead.com/?petcalc=0md00fozzbz
If you are BM and have the extra points then points in stm and armor might be a good idea.
Do you know any clever strategies for hunting with Cats, or are there any particular gotchas to watch out for?
Not really aside what I said about pvp.
Would you recommend a Cat?
Must have <3
Cats…what more can be said that hasn’t already been said? I find it hard to believe that any hunter over level 40 or so hasn’t at least tried one, they’re everywhere and there is always one at your level.
That said, doesn’t the pet some hunters run with say a lot about who they are? What I mean is that cats are very people friendly. They are familiar, they are comfortable to us and lets face it, they look good and their are some great cat skins.
I’m 51 point BM and have two cats, Sian-Rotam and Loque’Nahak. Having just tamed Loque recently, I am doing a lot with him right now (and yes, the DPS is a bit lower, but he looks incredible and everyone stops and stares/comments about him). I also have a worm tank and two wolves.
Cats are still DPS desirable, if that is what you’re about. I am not a huge fan of a lot of the exotics, as they are either too big or have odd animations/sounds, which is a shame. It’s all been said already, but cats certainly hold their own (if not being a notch above most others) in terms of damage output. No, they are not tanks, but they weren’t intended to be. If that is the playstyle of the hunter, then a cat is not for them. IMO, however, cats are still one of the best solo play pets.
And, to comment along the lines of others, I actually take my wolf in to any type of instance or raiding situation for the double AP buffs. I personally don’t care about being on the top of the damage meter at the end of the raid, I see my wolves as being helpful to the entire raid and not just myself…and to me, that’s what grouping is all about. That said, Loque will see the inside of Naxx at some point just because ;)
I do not like cats. Despite that, my night elf does have one due to the awesome synergy between prowl and shadowmeld. My main troll hunter, however, will not use a cat. Period. That being said, I can still comment on them.
Prowl-It does make a nice opener since it does increase the damage the cat does with the first attack it does out of prowl. I prowl my night elf’s cat about 95% of the time when I send him into attack.
Rake-Very nice damage output, and really shines if you have a warrior or feral druid in your group since rake’s damage is increased by mangle or trauma.
Cats are good for just about everything, except PvP (simply due to how squishy pets are in that realm, even more so since it’s ferocity) and tanking. That’s not saying a cat can’t tank but it’s just not meant to do it to the extent that a bear or gorilla could.
Even without the four talent points from the beast mastery talent, it’s still possible to grab all of the DPS increasing talents: Bloodthirsty, spider’s bite, rabid, spiked collar, and call of the wild. Having beast mastery actually gives you more points than you have useful talents for putting them into.
Despite my personal opinions, I recommend a cat to just about every hunter that can stand to look at the same thing that every other hunter has. They’re really quite good and will probably remain kings of the hill, even after the nerf.
This is an aside, and not directly related to the RFC. There is no pet you absolutely HAVE to have. None. Not a gorilla. Not a cat. Nothing. EVERYTHING, every single pet, is now doing very good damage, with some just happening to be ahead of others. It isn’t a massive amount ahead. It may be a large one, but it won’t be the end of the world if your pet isn’t absolutely ‘Teh bestest evar’. Every pet has its pro’s, every pet has its cons. IF you are some one who is out to enjoy the game, and not a min/maxer, use whatever pet makes you happy. Sporebat, tallstrider, moth, wasp, go happy with it. My personal pick always has been, and always will be wolves. I just really like cats, in real life. *Laughs*
To sum it all up, cats ARE amazing, but you don’t HAVE to have one to have the best pet. They just do their job well, and happen to deal a bit more damage in the process.
My first 60 and first 70 was a BM hunter (started back when BM wasnt cool). i got the Rake at 10 and then Humar even though is attack speed wasnt the best and just fell in love with his looks. I dabbled with other pets but I never replaced HUmar. He could off tank in regular instances and even (briefly) in heroics.
Then came WotLK. The way they revamped pets in general amounted to a huge nerf to my playstyle. I dont know if I will ever be able to play my hunter again.
Pro:
Looks, runing with a cat at your side is just stylish
Excellent DPS. Cats according to bliz should fall 2nd (roughly) in the DPS list.
Prowl Agro: Prowl, hit dash, wrath just before the strike and you have a pet with a nice solid agro lead on you opening up. Boar’s speed also works wonders for negating this downside.
Con:
Fragile: Think Rogue fragile. They look tough and everything is great then ZOT! “Morw!” puff of fur drifting through the air…
Soft Agro generation: They arent tanks and cant ‘hold’ agro. Again like a rogue they might be able to thorugh sheer dps, if your lucky.
Pros:
1. Stylish. No other pet in game matches the grace and style of a big cat.
2. Excellent DPS. As Nirvana said, cats are actually doing a little TOO much damage right now. 3.0.8 should bring them in line with other pets, but they will remain one of the best straight up damage dealers in the game.
3. Nearly never need to be fed with the proper talents. This is true of all ferocity pets however.
Cons:
1. Lack of utility. While cats are great at dishing out large amounts of the hurt, they lack some of the more situationally useful skills of other families. Prowl is rarely ever used by most cat using hunters.
2. One of the more common pets. LOTS of hunters use cats. If you want something unique, that not lots of people use, it won’t be a cat.
In conclusion, good for soloing and raiding, less so for pvp due to their lack of utility. Great to look at, but everyone else thinks so too. Rake is good, prowl is kinda “eh”. I’ll never give up my kitty :)
It’s interesting to read this. I notice alot are saying “Cats dont hold any aggro”. Which is interesting to me because I actually have a hard time pulling aggro off my cat in a PvE battle. (Mind you PvE fights are about 15-20 secs in length on average).
I’m curious (purely for my own interest): To those who say their cat is holding no aggro; what’s your spec and AP at?
I’m still leveling – 73 now in Dragonblight. I’m specced 52/12/0 now, working to max out Longevity before starting to put more points in MM. My AP is listed at 1472 now on the armory -
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Nazgrel&n=Hechojazz
I’ve had trouble with pulling aggro from my cat since the expansion, and I also am not super pleased with its relative fragility compared in particular with Tenacity pets. I have both a Gorilla and a Croc now as well (and an Eagle).
I still take the cat when I run instances or group for quests. But as a solo tank I just find myself spamming Mend Pet too much, and pulling aggro when I wouldn’t with one of my other pets.
I am not having the Prowl/Cower bug problem, at least since I put both skills on my pet action bar. Hopefully Blizz will fix this soon though.
I LOVE my cat, and i dont plan on changing her after the nerft.
I never ever use prowl, and rake is just on autocast :)
She cannot hold aggro when solo if i dont use intermidation (or however that bm stun is spelled) or md to her… but she is my favorite pet and will be with me till the end of norrath :)
ohh btw forgot to add
Im beastmaster and my ap is 1522
Link to my profile on armory
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Chamber+of+Aspects&n=Nessima
The Cat “nerf” is that initial damage scaling is going from 7% to 6%. The DoT’s unchanged.
Yea, wtf?
When you say fragile, I hope your just refering to them taking a bit more damage then tenacity, because ferocity pets actually require less in the ways of mend pet then tenacity. Of all of my pets, I have to heal my ferocity pets the LEAST. Bloodthirsty, frenzy, serpents swiftness, and cobra reflexes tend to keep my wolf and cat alive through a lot more punishment then they ought to live through. So far I haven’t had a problem soloing any two or three man quests using my wolf or cat. Marksman and survivals mileage will vary, of course, but cobra reflexes and bloodthirsty are still there, and that is a fair part of the equation.
A thought on agro…
Ferocity pets weren’t designed to establish and keep agro like a tenacity pet. So, it isn’t a shame/dishonor for us to pull agro from our cats. Again, I’m not using my cat at the moment, I’m using my spirit beast. I often find myself using an MD and an FD every now and again. That being said, survivability is wonderful. I’ve been able to handle many 2-3 man quests with me and my beloved Ru’Ahk (even with his gimped dps). I will only assume that the same can be found with our beloved cats as well.
Z
I’ve recently resumed using a cat on my lvl 70 nelf hunter (30-31-0) post 3.0, and after some testing have found it quite a good pet; I found Boo held aggro considerably better if he opened with prowl than with charge – and having dash makes the prowl speed just about bearable… so I would say for PVE always take dash, but skip charge.
An additional note on prowl – the main reason I think most people dislike it is because it causes their pet to travel slooowly, when you’re walking around town or running from one fight to the next. The way I got around that was to turn prowl’s autocast OFF, and then activate it as needed via explicit /cast command from within my combat macro (I bundled it together with Hunter’s Mark and /petattack), thus making it more of a true alternative to charge.
I haven’t got an opinion on rake; I leave it on autocast and assume having it in combination with claw gives my cat a bit more overall dmg (?).
Otherwise in re: talent points I’ve found it expedient to spend cat talents on DPS boosting things wherever possible – as with DPS classes, DPS pet talent points usually are best spent on things that help the pet do what it was designed to do (i.e. kill stuff quick before it has time to inflict much harm) rather than try to branch out and be something it isn’t…
somehow, I feel, as much as dps is concerned, cats do outweigh most pets (including exotic) I havent tried spirit beasts but wasps / gorilladin / devilsaurs / wolves pale in comparison to the cat. Needless to say, after reading all the above posts, i’ll probably retame a cat, and take up a stable slot in place of my useless jormungar >.< also, jz wondering, do cats scale with AP or agi?
Armory link. http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Thaurissan&n=Kumlan
This is just based on my experience with my own cat, but I would DEFINITELY recommend a cat! So far, Ive found my way out of many tricky situations thanks to my lovely companion! Alas, there are pro’s and con’s.
Pros- their prowl is useful for hiding when in enemy territory and matches well with the NE shadowmeld- not to mention they look absolutely fantastic!
Cons- They aren’t quite as durable as some other pets, and when using dash they draw aggro easy.
As for Rake and Prowl? Well, I don’t have rake but I’m planning to obtain it sometime Soon, so I cant say much on that. But for Prowl- I use it A LOT and its very, VERY useful for stealth hunting and much more! I also have come to notice that Cats are good for PvP, Damage dealing, Soloing and grouping- so they are adapt very well to a lot of situations. Ive never gone raiding before I im not sure on that one.
Talents I’m fond of are Dash, More useful in PvP then anything else, I also use Prowl and Growl the most. Those are my favorites, But I avoid cower because I usually need my pet to tank alot. She even does good in dungeons If we lack a tank!
I suppose I can spare my favorite PvP technique. if your guarding the flag. Have your use prowl, make it stay next to the flag and put it on aggressive and Shadow in the corner. This way if any stealthing druids/rogues sneak in, your pet will attack them ASAP, thanks to aggressive! And they’ll never know whats coming!. So all in all, I definitely recommend Getting a cat as I pet.
(I have a NightSaber stalker, her name is Sasha. I got her at level 10 and im level 60 now, so ive spend 50 levels with her and loved every minute of it!)
-Satra
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