Comments on: Cunning Pets Add 5% DPS

By: Shakra

Shakra — Fri, 13 Mar 2009 20:24:38 +0000

I am posting horribly late on this, I know. What I have noticed, with my owl, is that when it is using the ‘Carrion Feeder’, that it will not move from the body, or do anything else, until it is done. That makes it a bit awkward at times, especially when I have gotten mobbed while feeding the owl, and he just ’sat’ there.

This is not even worth a copper piece, much less two of them. I am sure that this has already been noticed and discussed.

Thank you, though, for discussing the noteworthy talents in the cunning tree! I have done horribly in speccing my cunning pets, and have been looking for something that would give me an idea of what the ‘must have’ items would be,

By: [Hunter] WotLK Talents & Abilities Discussion - Page 92 - Elitist Jerks

[Hunter] WotLK Talents & Abilities Discussion - Page 92 - Elitist Jerks — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 19:41:46 +0000

[...] Originally Posted by PSGarak Neither of these are a problem if the ferocity talent tree is also balanced around being slightly worse than the cunning tree. If the bonuses plus the trees are balanced, there’s no need for the bonuses, or trees, to be balanced in their own right. Well, right now if you don’t have the 51-BM talent then Ferocity and Cunning pets are both perfectly viable. If you do have 51-BM then the additional points scale far better with Ferocity pets and you’re strongly advised as things stand to use one. RogueLeaderX – yep, there’s a reason for it being that way: see here [...]

By: Dweezill

Dweezill — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 04:19:06 +0000

I asked this question before, but never recieved any answers… so,I am gonna sk it again. For Carrion Feeder, will all Cunning pets be able to use this. This may sound like a stupid question, but not all pets in the tree can eat meat. So, I am curiosu to know if all the pets can use Carrion Feeder. Also, while I am writing something here, I am gonna throw in one more question. Does anybody know anything new about Caster pets? Are they going away? If so, when? Before or after WOTLK is released? If you have a caster pet before the change over, will it automatically become a regular pet after the change, or will you get to keep the caster pet? Or will I have to go out and recatch a Dragonhawk? Ok, that’s a few more questions than i expected, but I may as well get them in here. I am in the dark about the future of caster pets. If anybody knows anything, or can link a page that i can read the changes from, pease feel free to write. Thanks.

By: Nimizar

Nimizar — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 10:53:39 +0000

Wolverine Bite has nothing in common with the live version of Mongoose Bite:
- WB triggers when the target dodges, while the live MB triggers only when the hunter dodges
- WB cannot be dodged, parried or blocked, live MB is just a normal attack
- WB hits really hard relative to the pet focus dump abilities (405 damage for level 80 WB, compared to 120-170 damage for the level 80 rank of the focus dumps)

If you’re going to compare Wolverine Bite to anything, compare it to a version of a Warrior’s Overpower ability that does something like 200% weapon damage, not to a hunter’s Mongoose Bite.

The only thing wrong with WB as a talent as it currently stands is that you have to waste three points in a generally undesirable talent (Great Resistance) in order to unlock WB.

Feeding Frenzy (a 40% damage buff for the last 20% of the target’s health) also works out to about an 8% overall buff to a Cunning pet’s DPS.

And at a 30% chance per 1.5 seconds for a free 20-25 focus, Owl’s Focus ain’t bad either.

The ridiculous prereq talent for Wolverine Bite and the relative ineffectiveness of Carrion Feeder are my only real gripes with the Cunning tree – aside from those two issues it looks great.

By: Nissi

Nissi — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 10:11:54 +0000

@Palladiamors …

Let me clarify, I do not believe the tree is a bad one. The utility given with Owl’s Focus and Roar of Recovery would seem like a phenomenal pairing. My issues with the current tree is that it lacks any real focus. Yes, I know its thought to be the “Utility Tree” and thus it will be a bit more spread out than the other two. However, the tree itself is just a bundle of non synergy. Wolverine Bite being the equivalent to old school Mongoose Bite is going to be near worthless in both PvE and PvP settings. If the dodge requirement being removed would fix this, but I do not see that happening. Furthermore, its prereq of needing 3/3 Greater Resistance is stupid. (Although do not get me going about the Resistance Talent to begin with.)

The tree has some really good talents. Feeding Frenzy, Roar of Recovery, and Owl’s Focus (Provided there is no internal cooldown on the proc) are all phenomenal. If they can fix Wolverine Bite, make Feeding Frenzy a talent that is on par with the Health/Recovery talent in the other two trees this tree will be pretty damn good.

By: Palladiamors

Palladiamors — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 06:18:42 +0000

Outside of that though, Nimizar, would you please explain to everyone that the Cunning tree is not as bad as they seem to think it is?

And out of curiousity, why not make it so that they had something like improved leader of the pack, where a critical hit would restore so many hit points and so much loyalty…. that way it isn’t exactly the same as the ferocity talent…. just food for thought.

By: Nimizar

Nimizar — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 00:50:13 +0000

I haven’t watched it myself, but my understanding is that the hunter soloing Onyxia video relies heavily on the current Roar of Sacrifice bug where the pet doesn’t actually take any damage (i.e. correct behaviour of RoS is that if you use it to full effect, the pet will lose 50% of its max health and then the hunter will start taking damage again, but the current behaviour is that the hunter and the pet take zero damage for the whole 12 second duration). Still an impressive feat, but not really indicative of what will be possible once that bug is fixed.

As far as the stat modifiers go… they’re actually pretty minor details when it comes to overall pet effectiveness, and are mainly there as a balancing tool that Blizzard can tweak if they feel any of the 3 groups of pets is grossly overpowered or underpowered. Outside of absolute min/max pure DPS top-end raiding hunters, pet talents and family abilities are going to matter a lot more.

That said, I would definitely agree that Cunning is currently the weakest of the 3 trees, mainly because the happiness and health recovery mechanic of Carrion Feeder is fairly poor relative to Bloodthirsty for Ferocity pets and the Guard Dog/Blood of the Rhino combination for Tenacity pets. Carrion Feeder is a cute idea, but the only times there are likely to be enough edible corpses around to use it is when levelling or farming (and sometimes on instance/raid trash).

By: Rotseh

Rotseh — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 00:26:18 +0000

Well, let’s not forget what this post is about: They buffed the Cunning pets by giving them +5% DPS. They used to have +/-0% DPS before and you did not complain. :)

By: Kalalay

Kalalay — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:02:27 +0000

I had no idea Carrion Feeder was so non-functional, I agree, and hope they tidy that one up.

By: Nissi

Nissi — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 20:59:28 +0000

@Kalalay …

I would say I am excited about everything you mentioned there except the completely broken “Carrion Feeder”

Carrion Feeder as it is now is non functional I believe. Although it was changed to only work on non mechanical/elementals a few patches ago, it is extremely limited. It is completely subpar as a talent compared to the “loyalty/happiness” talents that are in the other two trees. Simply put, the ability requires “fleshy dead corpses” extremely close by to work. As a raider who currently, uses a Wind Serpent as my main pet, this is disconcerting. 95$ of fights where your pet may die, have no corpses around to feed on. While Ferocity/Tenacity pets have the quick fire ability to gain happiness back after a death regardless of the circumstances, Cunning pets do not.

I really hope they change this ability to be something akin to “Ripped Flesh” and require nothing more than a living monster or boss. Right now the so called “Utility Tree” is gimped from a raiding perspective. Is this tree the PvP tree? No its not. If it were in fact changed to be a more PvP centric tree then thats one thing, but its not.